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Ukraine’s prime minister on obstacles to meaningful peace with Russia

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JUDY WOODRUFF: There were signs of hope for a peaceful resolution to the conflict in Ukraine today.

But, as chief foreign affairs correspondent Margaret Warner reports, Ukraine’s prime minister has reservations.

MARGARET WARNER: Relative calm now prevails across much of Eastern Ukraine, after months of heavy fighting that claimed more than 3,000 lives.

Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko highlighted the turnabout yesterday.

PRESIDENT PETRO POROSHENKO, Ukraine (through interpreter): It is the first day in many, many weeks and months when Ukrainians have not had a single person killed.

MARGARET WARNER: On September 5, Kyiv signed a cease-fire blueprint with pro-Russian separatists, including granting more autonomy to Ukraine’s eastern regions. It also calls for a buffer zone. Ukraine’s military says it met with Russian and separatist officers near Donetsk today to outline it. But the Russians deny being involved.

They also deny supplying the separatists, nor sending Russian troops to assist, though, this summer, NATO estimated thousands of Russian combat forces were in Ukraine. This week, the alliance reported a significant drawdown of those troops.

Meanwhile, a war of words continues. On Wednesday, President Obama told the U.N. that Russian aggression in Ukraine threatens world order.

PRESIDENT BARACK OBAMA: This is a vision of the world in which might makes right, a world in which one nation’s borders can be redrawn by another.

MARGARET WARNER: In his speech, Ukrainian Prime Minister Arseniy Yatsenyuk urged the U.S. and Europe to maintain sanctions on Russia until his country regains all its territory, including Crimea.

I spoke with Prime Minister Yatsenyuk late yesterday in New York yesterday.

Mr. Prime Minister, thank you for having us.

ARSENIY YATSENYUK, Prime Minister, Ukraine: It’s a privilege for me.

MARGARET WARNER: President Poroshenko, your president, said Thursday in Kyiv that he thought the worst part of the war was behind you, that he thought actually there had been a transformation — that was his word — in Russia’s attitude toward Ukraine. Do you think so?

ARSENIY YATSENYUK: I’m very skeptical about Russia and the Russian president. I just don’t trust them.

I do understand their ultimate goal…

MARGARET WARNER: Which is?

ARSENIY YATSENYUK: … is to recreate Soviet Union to do something that resembles the Soviet-style empire.

But we had limited options on the table. And I do understand the decision that was made by President Poroshenko to stop talks in Minsk and to unfold a cease-fire and peace plan. The thing is that whether Russia is ready to execute and to implement this plan, because, knowing them, they will just try to pick the cherry, what they want, but not — but not what’s needed.

But, again, I am very skeptical, but it’s better to have cease-fire, rather than fire.

MARGARET WARNER: NATO officials said this week that they had seen significant numbers of Russian troops crossing back into Russia. Does that give you confidence?

ARSENIY YATSENYUK: We do understand that Russia, at this particular period of time, probably is interested in pulling back some forces, because Russia faced another problem.

Pulling back forces, Russia got coffins from the Ukrainian territorial of Russian soldiers. And these severely affected Russian population and then approval rate in the Russian president. So, if it’s true, this is the good news. But, again, let’s be very cautious.

To restore the control over the border, to pull back forces, to stop to support terrorists, these are the three preconditions for further talks.

MARGARET WARNER: Now, do you think that President Putin, despite what he says, is feeling the squeeze of the economic sanctions, the sort of multiple sanctions by both the U.S. and the E.U., that this is one of the reasons, in addition to the body bags coming back, that he has decided to pull back?

ARSENIY YATSENYUK: He says that he doesn’t care.

I will say that I don’t trust that he doesn’t care. Sanctions definitely have a tough and huge negative impact all with the Russian economy. So, in the long-term prospective, we do understand that sanctions will severely squeeze the ability and the capability of Russian economy, but we need to find a short-term and quick-time solutions.

MARGARET WARNER: President Poroshenko was in Washington late last week last week and he said — and I quote — “In the condition of war, the economy of Ukraine cannot survive.”

Now, you’re really the man in charge of getting this economy on its feet. Do you agree with that?

ARSENIY YATSENYUK: It’s difficult to find any economy in the world which can flourish having the war. And I can hardly imagine the way — how to attract international investors having Russian tanks and soldiers on your soil. The war is very expensive.

MARGARET WARNER: For you?

ARSENIY YATSENYUK: Absolutely.

MARGARET WARNER: Now, the latest sanctions that were imposed a couple weeks ago, the U.S. and E.U. made very clear that, if President Putin carried out the 12-point peace plan, which really has to do with the situation in the east, that those particular sanctions could be lifted.

Would you support that?

ARSENIY YATSENYUK: Let me elaborate over the definition what does it mean for me to change the course.

It means that we restore the control over Ukrainian territory, that we take back Crimea.

MARGARET WARNER: That’s a big one. President Obama didn’t mention taking back Crimea.

ARSENIY YATSENYUK: But, as far as I understand, that’s what he is thinking about.

MARGARET WARNER: Now, let me ask you about what your parliament passed a couple of weeks ago, which was a kind of limited autonomy for these eastern regions. Is that a prelude to the dissolution of part of Ukraine?

ARSENIY YATSENYUK: That’s what Russia wants, to get another frozen conflict in Europe. We are not allowed to legitimize this frozen conflict.

MARGARET WARNER: But, if we look ahead, is that the first step to essentially unsettling that whole part of Ukraine, making it impossible for you to have a unified state that would be attractive, say, to the E.U.?

ARSENIY YATSENYUK: Well, this is the Russian target. This is the Russian aim.

Our aim is to de-escalate the situation, to empower these regions with an additional authority, but to have these regions as an integral part of Ukraine. Not an easy job, but doable.

MARGARET WARNER: So, as a student of Ukrainian history and Russian history, what do you think it will take for Ukraine to be able to stand up to the Russian bear?

ARSENIY YATSENYUK: Usually, in my childhood, my mom told me a number of fairy tales. And the bear is a very good animal in Ukrainian fairy tales.

But, in reality, it’s better to have bear somewhere in the zoo.

MARGARET WARNER: To have them in the zoo.

Mr. Prime Minister, thank you.

ARSENIY YATSENYUK: Thank you.

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